Billy Howton: HOF?

Discuss candidates for the Pro Football Hall of Fame and the PFRA's Hall of Very Good
JameisLoseston
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Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:39 am

Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by JameisLoseston »

Hope may be dwindling for our friends Dilweg and Lewellen, but here's another Packer legend I've been pulling for for a while. Been in the HOVG since the beginning, and is the true successor to Don Hutson, breaking the latter's receiving yardage mark in his rookie season in 1952. Never quite matched that again thereafter, so one could deem him somewhat the OBJ of his era, but he had another spectacular year in 1956 and was still consistently one of the top receivers in a slow decade. Perhaps the biggest knock is he didn't get to play with Starr much, but I think he was as good as some much more well-known contemporaries such as Raymond Berry and Paul Warfield. 2 All-Pros, but somehow managed to not get one as a rookie, so might as well say 3. No one really seems to be talking about him, but I have to. imagine he is at least in the mix.

Other picks I like among the OG HOVG wideouts include Jim Benton and Del Shofner. I think Benton got overlooked because he was followed by Hirsch and Fears on the Rams, but he has a great argument to be considered the "second great receiver" right after Hutson, so that adds some historical value to his case. Howton probably needs to get in before Shofner is considered, since he had a fairly short run of elite play, but around the injuries, he sustained his peak level more consistently than Howton did; 5 well-earned All-Pros sure are shiny (also, old Delbert is definitely a first-ballot induction in the Hall of Names). However you order them, I prefer all of their candidacies to the likes of Cliff Branch, Harold Carmichael, and Harold Jackson, who seem to get a lot more press for reasons I can't make out based on era-adjusted performance. Curious for the community's take on this.
Zero26
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Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by Zero26 »

Yes. One of the most obvious picks of the earlier era.

When Hutson reset what good receiving stats look like Benton was the only comparable receiver until the talented receiver classes of the late 1940s. Whether you agree with it or not there's usually a clear reason a candidate wasn't inducted. Here there really is none. He has the stats(1000 yard seasons,2 going by rounding same as Hutson) he has the accolades(3 all pro teams, 5 honorable all pro mentions). Unlike say Hugh Taylor Benton won both won a championship with the Bears where he scored a TD and lost a championship game with the Rams where he had well over 100 yards. He also played more than long enough by the halls arbitary longevity standards which is the main issue for some of the other best receivers outside of the hall from the 40s and 50s. I don't really know the angle people who'd oppose Bentons case would use.

The issue with 30s,40s and 50s players particularly is the halls process puts players whose careers preceded the start of the process at a serious disadvantage in so many ways. But here that shouldn't have been relevant. In any case he's one of the reasons I think there should be a seperate Hall committee for players from the pre HOF era. If the HOF doesn't specify a time period those within living memory will always have an overwhelming advantage in the senior committee.

Milner was drafted 2 years earlier than Benton and Benton averaged almost 2.5 times Milners yardage and had almost 4 times the career touchdowns. While Milners not in the Hall based on the stats he's the 30s non Hutson HOF receiver with the better yardage stats(his were around 20 ypg, the best topped out at around 25). Bill Hewitt had the most touchdowns of a non Huston receiver in that era and Benton retired just 1 short of doubling his total second behind only Hutson.
RichardBak
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Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by RichardBak »

Good piece on why Howton isn't in the Hall.

https://www.si.com/nfl/talkoffame/nfl/b ... tball-hall
Brian wolf
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Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by Brian wolf »

Benton won championships with the Rams and Bears and should be in the HOF along with Howton and Shofner with Billy Wilson, Hugh Taylor and Ray Renfro having cases as well. Had Ken Kavanaugh had more catches and Harlon Hill not had injuries, they both would have made it as well. Renfro for the Browns lacked catches as well but was clutch for a run heavy team, especially in postseason, and deserves a look. My question is, should Nickel be considered the first great TE, or another great inside receiver like Pihos and Fears ? We know he should at least be HOVG ...
Brian wolf
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Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by Brian wolf »

For me, Howton and Carroll Dale might be the most underrated receivers in NFL history ... Imagine had the Browns kept Howton to team with Renfro instead of giving him up for being a player's union leader ?
JameisLoseston
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Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:39 am

Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by JameisLoseston »

So basically everyone agrees that I'm onto something, these old guys deserve a look, and the reasons for their omission are decidedly subpar. So go on and recommend them already, PFRA! Not that that's gotten Dilweg anywhere...
Billy Wilson, Hugh Taylor and Ray Renfro having cases as well. Had Ken Kavanaugh had more catches and Harlon Hill not had injuries, they both would have made it as well.
These all seem like potential HOVG nominees as well, if none are in already (not positive). I'd rather Bill Groman and Lionel Taylor first, though.
Brian wolf
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Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by Brian wolf »

Wilson is in the HOVG and I endorsed Hugh Taylor before the cutdown vote ...
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TanksAndSpartans
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Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by TanksAndSpartans »

Zero26 wrote:If the HOF doesn't specify a time period those within living memory will always have an overwhelming advantage in the senior committee.
This is a great line. Unfortunately, the same thing is going on with the HOVG. I have the exact number in a different thread, but I think we had 3 pre-WWII players chosen for HOVG in the past 11 or 12 years.
Zero26
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Location: NYC

Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by Zero26 »

Zero26 wrote:Yes. One of the most obvious picks of the earlier era.

When Hutson reset what good receiving stats look like Benton was the only comparable receiver until the talented receiver classes of the late 1940s. Whether you agree with it or not there's usually a clear reason a candidate wasn't inducted. Here there really is none. He has the stats(1000 yard seasons,2 going by rounding same as Hutson) he has the accolades(3 all pro teams, 5 honorable all pro mentions). Unlike say Hugh Taylor Benton won both won a championship with the Bears where he scored a TD and lost a championship game with the Rams where he had well over 100 yards. He also played more than long enough by the halls arbitary longevity standards which is the main issue for some of the other best receivers outside of the hall from the 40s and 50s. I don't really know the angle people who'd oppose Bentons case would use.

The issue with 30s,40s and 50s players particularly is the halls process puts players whose careers preceded the start of the process at a serious disadvantage in so many ways. But here that shouldn't have been relevant. In any case he's one of the reasons I think there should be a seperate Hall committee for players from the pre HOF era. If the HOF doesn't specify a time period those within living memory will always have an overwhelming advantage in the senior committee.

Milner was drafted 2 years earlier than Benton and Benton averaged almost 2.5 times Milners yardage and had almost 4 times the career touchdowns. While Milners not in the Hall based on the stats he's the 30s non Hutson HOF receiver with the better yardage stats(his were around 20 ypg, the best topped out at around 25). Bill Hewitt had the most touchdowns of a non Huston receiver in that era and Benton retired just 1 short of doubling his total second behind only Hutson.
Sorry everyone it was late and I sometimes confuse these two players. Disregard this post. I have Howton in the HOF though he's a bit further down my heirarchy of WR's outside the Hall.
JameisLoseston
Posts: 391
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:39 am

Re: Billy Howton: HOF?

Post by JameisLoseston »

Sorry everyone it was late and I sometimes confuse these two players. Disregard this post. I have Howton in the HOF though he's a bit further down my heirarchy of WR's outside the Hall.
Discussion of Benton is welcome as well. I take it he's on your top priority list?
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