Professional Football Researchers Association Forum

In 1988, the Dolphins passed up on Thurman Thomas in the first round. That turned out to be fatal.

With Thanksgiving coming up, I just revisited the 1980 Bears Lions Thanksgiving matchup for the podcast. Sometimes in memory banks, games are only remembered for one play, and this was one of them -- for me at least.

Of course, we all (well, those of us who watched it) we all remember the overtime kickoff return that won the game for Chicago. And of course, the Lions blew a 17-3 lead in the fourth. There was a lot I didn't remember, however, and the most important fact was that the Lions actually held first place in the NFC Central before the game. And Detroit's defense had a really good game until that fourth quarter. Lastly, the game actually cost the Lions a playoff spot -- the division tiebreaker went to Minnesota by conference winning percentage (Minn 8-4, Det 9-5)

So, what if the Lions don't have that fourth-quarter meltdown? What if the Bears don't win the coin toss and the Lions win the game? Or if the Lions defense holds them? Let's say the Lions win that game and go 10-6 that year. They make the playoffs after going 2-14 the previous season.

Add to that -- Let's say the Lions make the FG at the end of the playoff game against SF in 83. Or at least the extra point and send the game to OT.

Monte Clark was a pretty good coach from what I remember. Would his career with the Lions have turned out differently with just a nudge of luck in these games?

Of course the bottom fell out after Billy Sims was injured. But what if Clark gained more success beforehand? He came close.

GameBeforeTheMoney wrote:With Thanksgiving coming up, I just revisited the 1980 Bears Lions Thanksgiving matchup for the podcast. Sometimes in memory banks, games are only remembered for one play, and this was one of them -- for me at least.

Of course, we all (well, those of us who watched it) we all remember the overtime kickoff return that won the game for Chicago. And of course, the Lions blew a 17-3 lead in the fourth. There was a lot I didn't remember, however, and the most important fact was that the Lions actually held first place in the NFC Central before the game. And Detroit's defense had a really good game until that fourth quarter. Lastly, the game actually cost the Lions a playoff spot -- the division tiebreaker went to Minnesota by conference winning percentage (Minn 8-4, Det 9-5)

So, what if the Lions don't have that fourth-quarter meltdown? What if the Bears don't win the coin toss and the Lions win the game? Or if the Lions defense holds them? Let's say the Lions win that game and go 10-6 that year. They make the playoffs after going 2-14 the previous season.

Add to that -- Let's say the Lions make the FG at the end of the playoff game against SF in 83. Or at least the extra point and send the game to OT.

Monte Clark was a pretty good coach from what I remember. Would his career with the Lions have turned out differently with just a nudge of luck in these games?

Of course the bottom fell out after Billy Sims was injured. But what if Clark gained more success beforehand? He came close.

What if? What if?? We're talking the Lions here. Even if they'd made the playoffs they probably would've all overslept the day of the game and it would've been forfeited. Or there would've been a tornado or the team bus would've taken a wrong turn and wound up in North Dakota. Again, we're talking the Lions..... Anything can happen and usually does.

Speaking of the Lions, had Meadows for the Bears not knocked out Bobby Layne in the final game of the 1956 regular season, Layne and Detroit may have won the game, the division and had an interesting championship game matchup against the Giants and QB Charlie Conerly, though Heinrich would have "started" the game ...

GameBeforeTheMoney wrote:With Thanksgiving coming up, I just revisited the 1980 Bears Lions Thanksgiving matchup for the podcast. Sometimes in memory banks, games are only remembered for one play, and this was one of them -- for me at least.

Of course, we all (well, those of us who watched it) we all remember the overtime kickoff return that won the game for Chicago. And of course, the Lions blew a 17-3 lead in the fourth. There was a lot I didn't remember, however, and the most important fact was that the Lions actually held first place in the NFC Central before the game. And Detroit's defense had a really good game until that fourth quarter. Lastly, the game actually cost the Lions a playoff spot -- the division tiebreaker went to Minnesota by conference winning percentage (Minn 8-4, Det 9-5)

So, what if the Lions don't have that fourth-quarter meltdown? What if the Bears don't win the coin toss and the Lions win the game? Or if the Lions defense holds them? Let's say the Lions win that game and go 10-6 that year. They make the playoffs after going 2-14 the previous season.

Add to that -- Let's say the Lions make the FG at the end of the playoff game against SF in 83. Or at least the extra point and send the game to OT.

Monte Clark was a pretty good coach from what I remember. Would his career with the Lions have turned out differently with just a nudge of luck in these games?

Of course the bottom fell out after Billy Sims was injured. But what if Clark gained more success beforehand? He came close.

On the other hand, what if the Lions didn't have too many men on the field in their Week 2 game against the Redskins in 1979?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RwXdieqmtTo

If they don't commit the penalty, and if they win in OT, they don't get Billy Sims in 1980, more than likely. Sims goes to SF #1 overall. As a result, maybe Monte Clark doesn't last there as long as he does.

Oh wow....then you have Billy Sims with the 49ers under Bill Walsh? Plus, he'd be playing more on grass which might have helped prolong his career. A lot of possibilities just with that scenario.


As for it "being the Lions" -- maybe it's not a case of "What if?" then it is "How would they find a way to lose?" with them? Laughs....

Washington blew a lot of leads that year -- the Oilers in Week 1, Detroit Week 2, Dallas in the final week. That's another "What if..." as far as not blowing leads. They barely missed the playoffs.

The other curious thing about 1979 and 12 men on the field is the Thanksgiving game at Dallas was partially decided by a 12 men on the field penalty against Dallas on a Houston Oilers punt. The penalty gave Houston a first down and Pastorini threw the game-winning TD to Kenny Burrough on the next play. Not sure if that affected the Cowboys' playoff seeding that year. May have affected Houston and the Eagles. The Oilers position was decided by the time their Week 16 game against Philadelphia started and a lot of their starters only played a half or so. Philadelphia needed to win and if I remember right, they got a home game after beating Houston in conjunction with the Dallas comeback over Washington.

People talk about that great win engineered by Staubach against the Redskins to win the division in 1979 but to have a chance, the Cowboys had to beat the Eagles in the Vet, which was another great Staubach win. Once he had another concussion against the Rams in the playoff - though still playing the game at the end -- it was all over.

GameBeforeTheMoney wrote:Oh wow....then you have Billy Sims with the 49ers under Bill Walsh? Plus, he'd be playing more on grass which might have helped prolong his career. A lot of possibilities just with that scenario.

I know it is totally irrelevant to our purpose here but that is exactly what happened in a Strat-o-matic football league I was in during the 1980s. I drafted Sims to the '81 Niners and won a championship with that team.
With Sims and Earl Cooper I had one of the best pass catching backfields ever...

Good times...

Brian wolf wrote:Speaking of the Lions, had Meadows for the Bears not knocked out Bobby Layne in the final game of the 1956 regular season, Layne and Detroit may have won the game, the division and had an interesting championship game matchup against the Giants and QB Charlie Conerly, though Heinrich would have "started" the game ...

I had the opportunity to examine that game film on a trip to Mt Laurel. When you get to that play there's a splice. Somebody clipped out just the hit on Layne.